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Processed Video lags 2 frames - Vegas 8 Pro

 
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ECB



Joined: 21 Aug 2008
Posts: 11

PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 6:30 pm    Post subject: Processed Video lags 2 frames - Vegas 8 Pro Reply with quote

I am using Vegas 8 Pro (latest build) and Neat Video Pro 2.2. When I use Neat Video (interlace mode) with a DV clip the processed clip is exactly the same length as the original but the video is shifted (delayed) 2 frames and the last 2 frames are cut off. What am I doing wrong?

Ed B
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NVTeam



Joined: 01 Sep 2005
Posts: 2237

PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2008 3:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Generally, this is a Vegas issue. Please see this topic for more information.

Hope this helps,
Vlad
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ECB



Joined: 21 Aug 2008
Posts: 11

PostPosted: Fri Aug 22, 2008 7:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you for your response.

Based on the response so far it does not look like there will be a solution from Sony in the near future. In the interim is it possible for Neat Video to detect and flag (optically mark ie clear, black ...) the duplicate frame(s) so the user could find and delete the errant frames? Do you have any workarounds until Sony addresses this problem?

Ed B
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NVTeam



Joined: 01 Sep 2005
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 23, 2008 12:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Since such errant frames are either in the beginning or end of the clip, you can overlap these parts of the clip with the preceding and/or consequent clips for a few frames. This would replace the errant frames with frames from other clips.

Vlad
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ECB



Joined: 21 Aug 2008
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 23, 2008 11:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have been running some tests to see where the duplicate frames are being generated by adding unique numbers to each of the frames. I added 24 frames at the beginning and end of the clip and rendered the clip making it continuous before I applied the Neat Filter. I can find the added frames but the last frame in the middle section was deleted which I did not expect. The last frame of the entire clip was deleted and that was expected. Given the clip is contigeous, why is last frame in the middle clip missing (deleted) or is that expected?

Ed B
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NVTeam



Joined: 01 Sep 2005
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 23, 2008 12:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Have you added blank frames? Could you e-mail me the clip with added frames? I will try to directly reproduce the effect.

Thank you,
Vlad
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ECB



Joined: 21 Aug 2008
Posts: 11

PostPosted: Sat Aug 23, 2008 2:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I added text media numbered frames at the beginning and end. I sent the clip to support. It is a sub section of the whole clip but it demos the problem. It is a zipped file ~ 897KB.

Ed
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NVTeam



Joined: 01 Sep 2005
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 23, 2008 3:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you for the clip. Yes, it is more clear now. The effect is caused by the fact there are dublicated frames in the main clip (each frame participates two times). To correctly operate in Vegas, NV has to apply special treatment to dublicate frames in general and in some cases this leads to dropping one of such dublicated frames (the last one in the end of the original clip). There should be no such an effect in a regular clip that contains no dublicate frames, it only shows up when there are dublicates.

Hope this helps,
Vlad
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ECB



Joined: 21 Aug 2008
Posts: 11

PostPosted: Sat Aug 23, 2008 3:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That helps alot! I had forgotton about the pulldown. The dublicated frames are result 15fps 8mm movie film being converted to 29.97fps by pulldown. The rest is 'easy'.

The Neat Video filter does a fantastic job of removing grain/pattern noise from 8mm film and much much more.

Thank you for you help, support and a fantastic product!

Ed Baldwin
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ECB



Joined: 21 Aug 2008
Posts: 11

PostPosted: Wed Aug 27, 2008 5:31 pm    Post subject: Workaround for extra or lost frames. Reply with quote

I have run additional tests with Neat Video and figured out a workaround for the duplicated and lost frames caused by the Sony plug-in. I added a 10 frame numbered clip at beginning and the end of the clip to be processed. I used numbered leaders so I could see what was happening with Neat Video. I rendered the clip with the number trailers (no Neat Video processing yet) to create a contiguous clip. Next, I added the Neat Video fx and rendered the clip. When I looked at the rendered clip the duplicated frames (causing the problem) were in the numbered leader and the lost frame was now the first frame in the trailing leader. By trimming off the numbered leader and trailer l have the processed video with no frames lost or duplicated and I can add the sound track - no sync issues. Clips with duplicated frames are little more difficult. The duplicate frames may cause Neat Video to throw away the last frame or next to last frame depending on the location of the duplicate frames. It is not difficult to determine which frame was dropped and replace it with a duplicate frame from the processed clip.

Give it try as see if it works for you.

Ed B
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